From: vexen	Date: January 5th, 2007 09:13 am (UTC)		(Link)

I cross-posted this: Religion and Intelligence discussion on the LiveJournal Atheist Community, where it got a load of comments.

From: zodacare	Date: March 15th, 2007 02:46 am (UTC)		(Link)
Religion and intelligence

There may be a correlation between low IQ and being religious, but what if there is a gene for religion? Every gene in our bodies has been selected for, so religion may have a survival purpose and that may be why it has persisted in the population. Religion may just be a side effect of consciousness. People can misinterpret the world around them, but when it comes to the crunch, the only thing you can trust is your own thoughts and feelings. As a scientist, I only go on evidence, but what if that evidence comes from your own personal experiences? If you restrict your mind to purely scientific thought, you cannot truly explore the possibilities the Universe has to offer.

	From: vexen	Date: March 15th, 2007 06:09 pm (UTC)		(Link)
	Re: Religion and intelligence

That a gene is selected for doesn't make the underlying point of the gene correspond to any kind of reality; for example, the Peacock's ridiculous tail, and female breast size, both have genes that are selected for (just like proposed genes for religious behaviour), but this doesn't say anything about the truth of religious ideas, and about religious behaviour (that it has at times in history, led to increased rates of survival for children). And as you imply yourself, religion can easily be a by-product of other normal behaviours. It can itself be an abnormal. For a much fuller discussion of the psychological causes of religous beliefs and behaviour, see:

"The Causes of Religion: Psychological and physiological causes of religious belief and behaviour" by Vexen Crabtree (2007).

Finally, on your point about the scope of religion, please note that scientists can understand many phenomenon without immersing themselves in it. Weathermen can understand the weather and report about its causes and effects, without actually sitting in the rain or shouting into a microphone in a hurricane. We can study the internal metabolism of the stars, without actually being there, and the most important comparison is this famous one: It is perhaps better if you study drunken behaviour without actually being drunk yourself, and such is the truth of the scientific study of religion.

From: zodacare	Date: March 23rd, 2007 02:49 am (UTC)		(Link)
Religion and Intelligence

Hello Vexen, thank you for replying to my comment on Religion and Intelligence.

I think probably a high proportion of people who are born into a particular religion accept it as part of their social conditioning and may not have the opportunity to choose what they believe. There is always variation in any population for any type of behaviour, intelligence seems to be in part genetic and can occur at random and so perhaps religious behaviour can too.

Free-thinking people such as ourselves either are religious or they are not, suggesting a predisposition.

People seem to go through religious phases in their lives depending on their circumstances which suggests that it is the result of cognitive processes. In my experience I have found that religious people tend to be happier and more content about life because they ask less questions. Perhaps there is a correlation between having an enquiring mind and not being religious and having a closed mind and being religious.

Although much can be learned from observation, there is no substitute for experience. As an obsever of human behaviour you have to draw conclusions based on the experiences of others. If you purely observe, you can describe something as you see it but not as it feels to be part of it. An important part of science is to be experimental and see what happens.

From: (Anonymous)	Date: May 17th, 2007 06:05 am (UTC)		(Link)
Differing Points of View

Biased view points have always been a hinderance in society. I, a professing Christian, am greatly disturbed by this site. I know and correspond with numerous intelligent people, scientists and others, who are devout followers of the Christian faith. Their I.Q. is nothing below average. I myself love science, and yet, I remain a Christian. I know the contradictions, I've read them and debated them. Science is based on observation. No theory is ever proven true, a scientist can only fail to reject it. You do not believe in God, I do. I respect your choice to not believe in God. Just remember, your theories aren't the only one out there.

	From: blayzebright	Date: June 11th, 2007 04:17 pm (UTC)		(Link)
	Re: Differing Points of View

Your reasoning can be considered flawed since you are basing it on the people you know and hang out with. You might choose to hang out with intelligent religious people, which do exist. The study didn't say no religious people were intelligent, only that the -average- was lower.
The study above used information from several dozen scientific studies, and represents a far large population sample, one that you cannot claim to be more accurate than. Perhaps you might counter with data on an actual scientific experiment or survey done, if you know of one that shows your view.

From: (Anonymous)	Date: September 11th, 2007 01:37 pm (UTC)		(Link)
Re: Differing Points of View

I was delighted to see someone actually commenting from a faith point of veiw! The title of the strand says it all - differing points of view. This site and all those created by Vexen are his veiws only - I wonder why he believes in satan and not god? Is his intelligence any higher or any lower as regardless of what he says, surely he is a monothiest, being a satanist?

	From: blayzebright	Date: June 11th, 2007 04:22 pm (UTC)		(Link)

To me it is simply a matter of two things:

1) People who are religious are taught not to decide or question for themselves since God has decided everything for them, thus they make less use of vital sections of their brain which then loose function.
2) A more intelligent person tends to nit-pick and pull out flaws inherent in a religion. They tend to notice the contradictions, fallacies, and atrocities inherent in many religions more than a less observant person.

Of course those theories are hard to test, so I could be wrong :)

From: (Anonymous)	Date: August 4th, 2007 01:53 pm (UTC)		(Link)
I am confused

Hey hi vexen i'm 16yrs old girl from mauritius. I've been reading all your stuff on satanism since i'm 13yr and i really like your poimt of view about life,.. Since child i have always doubted on the existence of 'god'. But now there is a problem, When i tell my mother that i am an athiest (when she compels me to pray), she keeps on asking me that if there's no god, who created me and frankly i have nothing strong to tell her. Can you help? Rep on sinister_sophia@hotmail.com

From: (Anonymous)	Date: October 23rd, 2007 09:52 am (UTC)		(Link)
Religion

Hey,

I'm not sure if I agree with everything you say here, but I found your investigation into divorce rates interesting. I am a born again Christian, and one thing I have noticed over the past year is just how many Christian couples are getting married at a really young age! Too young in my opinion i.e. around the 20 mark. One couple has only been together half a year or so and are already engaged. Perhaps they are so caught up in the whole idea of Christian marriage and the joy it will bring, perhaps it has something to do with sex?
The other part I was reading was on intelligence and religion. Now just because more intelligent people are less likely to be religious doesn't make religion 'wrong'. It could mean that their own pride in their intellect restricts them from opening up to anything spiritual and new. Jesus did say we have to be like children i.e. stop being so proud and arrogant, if we are to really accept him. Also, religion is not God and the relationship many of us share with him. It is the organistation of many individuals who are not really Christians and it may place rules and regulations on you like the Catholic church, which I think is the one thing that has stopped most people coming to God.

Anyway good job with the website mate.

Mike