2005

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Vexen Crabtree's Live Journal

Sociology, Theology, Anti-Religion and Exploration: Forcing Humanity Forwards


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Jesus did not exist

"Jesus Did Not Exist" by Vexen Crabtree

Religous Experience

(Anonymous)

2006-04-14 08:45 am (UTC)

I was brought up in the church and had a very strong faith. It seems totally unjust to rationally believe that an innocent baby should be born with original sin - because of the sins of it's parents ( whoose ancesters were Adam and Eve).
I struggled to believe in God and Jesus for many years - aided by what I thought were supernatural revelations or 'highs'.
It's obvious to me that the religous experiences that people go through on an emotional level are in fact, a manifestation of Bipolar Disorder. It is a chemical imbalance in the brain. As such it is possible to believe in the irrational. When people have doubts about faith it is because they are coming down from a 'high'.
As a rule of thumb, i think that if people behaved towards each other in the way that Jesus exorted us to, the world would be a much beter place.
Unfortunately, the church and believers are often mor interested in 'playing God' as Judge instead of forgiving and being unconditional in their largesse towards ech other. Jesus said, 'love thy neighbour' - full stop. It wasn't conditional. The 'Christian Club' will always be there for you as long as you unquestionably go along with everything that it teaches - ask awkward questions - and you're out. It's about time we al grew up and decided to be nice to each other just for the sake of it - becuase it makes sense. We shouldn't need religon to make us do that.
In my experience, Christians and priests have been some of the most hateful people I have met. It's really worrying when people like Blair and Bush think that they have a mandate from God to go to war when they have a 'divine revelation'.
Believe me - with all the talk about charity - the church won't give a toss about you when you fall on hard times. Whilst you've got something to offer in the way of talent, social standing or money - it will embrace you like a rash!
The Beatles were right, 'All you need is love' - if we could get that right - everything else would fall into place.
Has is ever occured to you that in all the countries which are predominated by Christianity there is more fammine and poverty than anywhere else? The only thing they have left - is hope, but all the prayer in the world doesn't seem to make any difference. If God knew that us humans were going to make such a mess of the world with 'reknowledge' why did He design the world like it is? The church will tell you that it is because of free will. If you knew that your kid was going to go out and shoot someone even though you knew it was wrong - would you still give hime freewill? I hope not. You'd be a lousy parent if you did.

Re: Religous Experience

(Anonymous)

2007-07-26 08:45 pm (UTC)

Hi , Listen It sounds like you have had a bad experience in your early years with your church (I'm guessing so please forgive me if I'm wrong). I also grew up in a very strict catholic family and went to a catholic school, It amazes me to see how many christian churches and christians around the world feel the need to be forcefull in spreading christianity. Where is the free will in that. The irony is that christians are called to follow the life of Jesus. What did Jesus do when people during his time didn't believe who he was? well he didn't force them to believe, in a lot of cases he just left. The Sermon on the mount is a good example of this, after the people started walking away in discust shaking their heads at what he was saying, he turned to his deciples and said to them are you now going to leave too and when he sent his diciples out to spread his message he told them if you enter a house and you are not welcome, turn away and leave that house, he never condoned using any kind of force (whether mental(through slander) of physical)to spread christianity because by doing that you are taking away someones free will to believe what they choose, Yet we do it all the time. You also mentioned that 'the church and believers are often mor interested in 'playing God', unfortunatly you are so right about this as well and it is sad that this is the case. But the thing is that we are at risk of rejecting God ironically by ourselves Judging who God is by the actions of his followers.
Two of my family members are christians and one is a pschyotherapist and is fully aware of the affects of brain chemical imbalance but if that was true look at how many true believers are in the world, that is alot of people with chemical imbalances.
Just to briefly comment on your last point about why God knowingly created the world knowing we were going to make such a mess. Well there is alot I don't understand myself about God but I do know he is hurting far more than we are about how messed up the world is but I think that God made us as free creatures because they are the only type of creatures who can love because love is something you do out of choice. you can't make someone believe otherwise they wouldn't be free.I suppose then we'd be like clones programmed to live a certain way but for the sake of the few who will be saved God has allowed things to unfold as they are.
I think the important thing to remember is that He calls us to believe out of choice not forcefully out of fear. The only time fear comes into anything througout history or in scripture is during judgment of some kind.
You also mentioned,' the church won't give a toss about you when you fall on hard times', my advice would be to walk away from anyone (or church) who claims to represent God or tries to spread Gods word through force or fear,or makes anyone(regardless of their race, sex or religion) feel inferior or less important just because they don't believe in Jesus. That creats divides and barriers which divides people and Jesus came to unite people.
Thats what jesus warned about when his diciples asked him about false churches or prophets, Good Churches bear good fruits(people), and should be there for you regardless of where you are in life. Unfortunatly I know this is not always the case.
And I know that a lot of churches will discriminate you because of maybe something you have done or a situation you are in, God does not discriminate and there is absolutly nothing you can do to make him love you any less.
Sorry to drag on a bit and I am sorry to hear of your experience. Its definitly not easy I can tell you, but I really do hope you find your way.
And you have probably guessed by now that I am a christian too <
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Hi , Listen It sounds like you have had a bad experience in your early years with your church (I'm guessing so please forgive me if I'm wrong). I also grew up in a very strict catholic family and went to a catholic school, It amazes me to see how many christian churches and christians around the world feel the need to be forcefull in spreading christianity. Where is the free will in that. The irony is that christians are called to follow the life of Jesus. What did Jesus do when people during his time didn't believe who he was? well he didn't force them to believe, in a lot of cases he just left. The Sermon on the mount is a good example of this, after the people started walking away in discust shaking their heads at what he was saying, he turned to his deciples and said to them are you now going to leave too and when he sent his diciples out to spread his message he told them if you enter a house and you are not welcome, turn away and leave that house, he never condoned using any kind of force (whether mental(through slander) of physical)to spread christianity because by doing that you are taking away someones free will to believe what they choose, Yet we do it all the time. You also mentioned that 'the church and believers are often mor interested in 'playing God', unfortunatly you are so right about this as well and it is sad that this is the case. But the thing is that we are at risk of rejecting God ironically by ourselves Judging who God is by the actions of his followers.
Two of my family members are christians and one is a pschyotherapist and is fully aware of the affects of brain chemical imbalance but if that was true look at how many true believers are in the world, that is alot of people with chemical imbalances.
Just to briefly comment on your last point about why God knowingly created the world knowing we were going to make such a mess. Well there is alot I don't understand myself about God but I do know he is hurting far more than we are about how messed up the world is but I think that God made us as free creatures because they are the only type of creatures who can love because love is something you do out of choice. you can't make someone believe otherwise they wouldn't be free.I suppose then we'd be like clones programmed to live a certain way but for the sake of the few who will be saved God has allowed things to unfold as they are.
I think the important thing to remember is that He calls us to believe out of choice not forcefully out of fear. The only time fear comes into anything througout history or in scripture is during judgment of some kind.
You also mentioned,' the church won't give a toss about you when you fall on hard times', my advice would be to walk away from anyone (or church) who claims to represent God or tries to spread Gods word through force or fear,or makes anyone(regardless of their race, sex or religion) feel inferior or less important just because they don't believe in Jesus. That creats divides and barriers which divides people and Jesus came to unite people.
Thats what jesus warned about when his diciples asked him about false churches or prophets, Good Churches bear good fruits(people), and should be there for you regardless of where you are in life. Unfortunatly I know this is not always the case.
And I know that a lot of churches will discriminate you because of maybe something you have done or a situation you are in, God does not discriminate and there is absolutly nothing you can do to make him love you any less.
Sorry to drag on a bit and I am sorry to hear of your experience. Its definitly not easy I can tell you, but I really do hope you find your way.
And you have probably guessed by now that I am a christian too <<but don't hold that against me... :)>>
Take care, and all the best
Thanks

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