Vexen Crabtree 2015

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Sociology, Theology, Anti-Religion and Exploration: Forcing Humanity Forwards


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Vexen Crabtree 2015
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Hypocrisy, Plagiarism and LaVey by John Smith

Hypocrisy, Plagiarism and LaVey by John Smith
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Sad, Sad

(Anonymous)
Just a sad attempt to excuse Christianity’s idiocy.

Conformity in your rebellion

(Anonymous)
I think the worst part of all of this, is that while most here are so frighten of one sort of comformity and praise, they so eagerly, and so blindly run into another.

There is little difference between Christians and Lavey's form of Satanism.

Oh, there isn't? But wait, there is more.

Christianity stole many of the Pagan's holidays, then attempted to monopolize religion by being a "supreme way" above all others, no matter how much older all the other religions might had been.

Lavey takes many of the pagan and older forms of santanic religons ideals, then also literally monopolize and claim to be the only true "Satanic" way, while also claiming to be the greatest way. Gee, that soulds a little familiar...

Both are uncompromising, arrogant and believe in their superiority. How is that much of a difference? Because one believes in god and one doesn't? Right. If Lavey's Satanism was the majority, it would be just like its so-called enemy.

The more things change the more they stay the same.

Anton LaVey

(Anonymous)
Anton LaVey was a great man. Who has the right to say otherwise??? He might have got ideas from other religions, however what religion hasn't? you are all hypocrites and i loathe you.

Baphomet Crowley LaVey
The Alien Elite

www.anton_lavey@the666club.com

Re: Anton LaVey

(Anonymous)
u r to be praised for this

So Satanism is wrong for Smulo?

(Anonymous)
So, after reading the article from john Smulo, I can´t understand if he only centralize in LaVey or in Satanism.

It´s simple to understand: Satanism is what it means "with or without LaVey", personally, I wished to meet LaVey, only to take a talk with him. He´s no one that another Satanist, hypocrite or not, but Satanism is true and more real than Christianism.

Thinks that The Christian Bible negate the basic Human desires, so a human will be a calf all life and after dying, he was SAVED....what? after death, we´re only rotten meat. There´s NO scientific proofs of another live. Christianism isn´t bad now, but in past it was the only way to keep the flock calm. So, only the Rich(**) could be who administer the thinking and the rest of people were "free and pure"....free of being as another living animal. If a man uses his own brain he was an heretic, remember that! (** Rich in material and cultural way [Remember that Joan of Arc doesn´t deserve to be a Messenger because he not even can´t read] That means that the only who have power, could be the one who will keep it and no men ar equal).

So... Smulo, don´t question Satanism at you have at least one proof of any valid Christian belief, specially Miracles or Live After Death (not Iron Maiden album)

Satanis.

our life

(Anonymous)
leave this be it is not for you to say
Anton was a wonderful man do not doubt him for he set many of us free.
we enjoy him
leave him be

Re: our life

(Anonymous)
We set ourselves free... that is the ESSSENCE of Satanism! Don't forget that!

The moment you say someone else saved you from anything (including saving you from oppression) YOU become a follower, no different then any mainstream religion!

If you don't get the point of Satanic idealism then don't call yourself one!

Re: our life

(Anonymous)
I agree wholeheartily!
Lavey is not the Satanic Christ for crine out loud, he was like us-simply a human beeing.


Re: our life

(Anonymous)
Anton Szandor Lavey was sentence to 8,900 years in the lake of fire. He can't save you. Try worshipping the Creator instead of the created.
GOD IS NOT WILLING THAT ANY SHOULD PERISH, BUT THAT ALL MIGHT BELIEVE ON HIS NAME-JESUS. Repent & be baptized! Jesus said, “I am God there is none besides me." "I am the Way, the Truth & the Life. No man comes to the Father except by me." "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son that whosoever believes in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life." "For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord." "As many as received Him to them He gave the power to become the sons of God the Father even to those who believe on His name." Jesus' healing ministry began with adult baptism.
A New Agenda: We the people need no gas & no electric to have a man child with the spouses of our youth around the world. We shall build homes without electric, without gas, without roofs that exceed 7 & 1/2 feet, & with incinerators to burn garbage, burn dung, burn urine, & burn blood rags so that the entire sisterhood has a man child with the husbands of their youth.
TAKE MY CONFESSION WITH YOU. I have smoked cigars for 11 years & have no lungs, liver & kidneys at 44 years old. I continue to live through the Lord Jesus Christ as I received the Holy Spirit at 4 years old & was baptized as an adult in 1997. I continue to read my Bible& now use burned dung, urine, blood rags & tobacco butts to make meat offerings to eat. The Old Testament says that burned dung, urine, & blood rags were a part of the laws of Moses. Yes, it was in 2001 while I was driving to Florida that I was talking to the saints in heaven & Isaiah said, "You know that 70 years from now the sun will be dimmed in the sky" Oh, I said, “I don’t know.” I went back over the Old Testament& it said, “The sun shall be dimmed in the sky” & "I shall make them eat the grass of the field.” & “all these things shall come to pass” before theLord Jesus Christ returns.
4 years ago I was stamping my feet at work over the excessive electric usage & complaining that I didn’t have a husband & children to God the Father. I prayed, kneeling at my bed as to adopting children. Then while I was at work I adopted over 500 children in Swahili (I was born with a spot-was a reject in Hebrew) to find out what day it was. I had been taught prophesy at Wheaton Evangelical Free Church in 1979 & 1980. We went back & forth in time while Governor Blagovich was verifying. We came up with 17 years of darkened sun before July 29, 2081.
July 29, 2081-the rapture of believers in Christ Jesus-all those who received the Holy Spirit-at the trumpet sound in heaven-1st the dead & then the living ascended to heaven in a twinkling of an eye
July 29, 2081-2088-the Great Tribulation-God’s wrath is poured out on the earth, Judgment of the Believers in Christ Jesus & the Marriage Supper of the Lamb in heaven
2088-3057-the Reign of Christ Jesus-(the Bible stated “1000 years” & in actuality it was 969 years)
3057-3059-the Devil is loosed out of the pit –(the Bible stated “a time & a half” & in actuality it was 1 & three fourths years)-the battle of Armageddon-the nations are drawn together for the last battle in the Valley of Megiddo-the Lord Jesus comes down of a white horse with the words, “King of Kings, Lord of Lords” written on His thigh & a sword comes out of His mouth to destroy all who are in the battle. The bible says that the blood runs a “horses’ bridle high” & birds feed on the bodies.
3059-the old heavens& the old earth pass away & the new heavens & new earth are created by the Lord Jesus Christ-at this point in time the Lord Jesus says,“Depart from me I never knew you.” to all who died in the battle of Armageddon, to those who took the mark of the beast in their right hand or forehead during the tribulation, to all who died during our time without receiving the Holy Spirit, & to all those who died during the flood of Noah’s day in wickedness. Jesus says, “In this world you shall have trouble, but I have overcome the world.”
Jesus says, “If we confess our sins He is faithful & just to forgive us our sins & to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.”
Sincerely, Allison Grace Karalus

Whether or not this was the case is open for debate. However, what is clear is that Zeena and Nikolas’ motivation for making public the myths behind LaVey’s self-created persona does not in itself provide a case against the accuracy of their information. The lack of adequate refutation of such details by the Church of Satan or anyone else is telling.

[snip]

One begins to wonder whether LaVey ever observed the hypocrisy of the Christians he described in the first place, or if like the rest of his story bound life, he merely created it out of his active imagination.


The fact that the Christians have not refuted his points is also telling. To hold Christians to a different standard implies that you may be guilty of hypocrisy if you are one.

In the preface to The Satanic Bible, LaVey wrote: "Herein you will find truth--and fantasy. Each is necessary for the other to exist; but each must be recognized for what it is." A substantial amount of The Satanic Bible, and Satanism, is fantasy - and I believe that many Satanists recognize that, although most don't.

The reason that most don't is because the first way they find out about Satanaims is via the Satanic Bible written by Lavey and the CoS. All of which try to debunk{w/out anything more than bias w/lack of proof} all the other Satanist groups and movements and organizations,etc. So, they get brainwashed into Lavey as hero, CoS as only true satanism{much the same way many Christina herders do to their sheep}and don't care to look into the validity of Laveys claims about himself, the CoS's actions or integrity; they just trust them blindly.
Lavey and the Church are talking about the symbolism w/in Satanism if I'm not mistaken, they are'nt talking about Laveys confabulations{I was reading Laveys Bible the other night, and Lavey points out about braggarts and how their bragginbgs are done not because of a healthy ego-but because they have ego issues and self-esteem issues; it would seem Lavey himself was at the topof this list of oen of these types ofpeopledue to his continued confabulations and propagtaion of them-ditto for the CoS},
It's just as difficult to remain Satanist when those that introduced you to it, whom you at first thought were seriuosly enlightneed and w/great integrity, trun out to be just as hypocritical as Moses, Fundy Jesus, and the fundamentalist/evangelical Christia Church are{this leads most Christians to give up their faith or become liberal christians once they find these truths out}speaking of liberal Christians leaving fundy Catholicism and Protestantism and starting liberal denoms w/more personal integrity; this is what many other Organizations/sects of Modern Satanism have attempted to do in the face of Laveys and CoS hypocrisies, and they provide credible evidence to prove these allegations, but not eh coS-all they do attack all the oters and do it w/venom and bias and a lack of actual proof{sounds like what the Catholic Church did to the Protestant and visa versa}.

Hail Satan
HAIL REASON1

You said:

"The reason that most don't is because the first way they find out about Satanaims is via the Satanic Bible written by Lavey and the CoS. All of which try to debunk [...] all the other Satanist groups and movements and organizations,etc"

When the CoS was founded and the Satanic Bible was written, no other Satanic organisations existed, and hence the Satanic Bible cannot debunk them. For example the FCoS and ToS were both founded quite a while after The Satanic Bible was written and The Church of Satan was founded, by ex-member OF the CoS.

The main comparable thing that was criticized in The Satanic Bible was the New Age movement, which Anton LaVey hated.

No right-minded Satanist considered LaVey a "hero". Maybe an anti-hero with as many negative personality traits as positive ones. Most do not look into LaVey's claims about himself because they're not into Satanism for LaVey, but for themselves. If we discovered tomorrow that LaVey had done it all for himself, no-one would be surprised, least of all LaVeyan Satanists.

plagiarism of redbeard?

(Anonymous)
In the foreword to Might Is Right, LaVey claims that he dedicated the Satanic Bible "to Ragnar Redbeard, whose might is right." If this is true, then it looks like he gave credit where it was due. Also, although LaVey may not have had many truly original ideas, what does it matter? I don't worship Anton LaVey, nor do I think he was perfect. his putting different philosophies together to create Satanism is what was important. Whether or not he "plagiarized" or even created a totally false identity is a moot point. True Satanists will not stop being Satanists upon finding out that LaVey wasn't perfect in every way. Nor would they stop being Satanists if a plethora of unsatanic discoveries about LaVey were suddenly made, because it is simply what they are regardless of his actions.

Re: plagiarism of redbeard?

(Anonymous)
Read the Satanic Bible... there is a claim that there was a dedication to Ragnar Redbeard... but it is also claimed that they conveniently removed it... why? Why remove the only citation of others' ideas that LaVey took? Further, why did LaVey take much of Crowley's ideas... and Eliphas Levi's ideas... and defame them?!

A Complete Waste of Time

(Anonymous)
This Paster wrote an article, assuming that Satanists would care. I never heard Anton LaVey claim his ideas were without precedent, nor do I think any less of him for having used powerful material such as the "plagiarized" Ragnar Redbeard material. As for his not providing footnotes, I can say that the Bible has no footnotes, and if it did, no one would be a Christian. Therefore, in a Satanic Bible, why give footnotes? The difference is that Christians assume that they are receiving everything straight from "GOD", whereas Satanists who use their intellect (say it with me, Christians: in-tuh-lekt) never touted LaVey as a Perfect Being, rather as an author, a man with some ideas, but knew he gained his influences elsewhere. Case in point: all of the Infernal Names are from different cultures from all over the world, and LaVey even gives reference to that in the Satanic Bible. Well, I've squandered enough time here.

Re: A Complete Waste of Time

(Anonymous)
You obviously haven't read many bibles have you... the Christian Bible DOES have footnotes to clarify each verse!

Before you make a point, at least make an attempt to know what your talking about!

So What?

(Anonymous)
LaVey was no doubt a great man, who brought about the world’s first, aboveground, Satanic religion.

The CoS is not a "LaVey fan club". If every word he ever said about his life was false, then I respect him more for what he has achieved. It would be foolish to assume LaVey told the entire truth about his past (would you?), but this has no hold on the validity of Satanism as a religion whatsoever. Remember the Devil always has been the father of lies!

Remember LaVey taught us to question everything… including him.

At the end of the day, it really makes no difference whether he was lying or not. Satanism is here to stay! Moreover, it's still just as valid regardless of LaVey's credibility as a person. I certainly prefer the myth.

HAIL SATAN!
HAIL ANTON SZANDOR LAVEY!

Re: So What?

(Anonymous)
According to LaVey's own FBI files LaVey admitted that he had absolutely NO interest in Satanism at all, and the only reason he was involved in the opening of the Church of Satan was to make money. But, as we know from LaVey's bankruptcy forms, we know that he failed to do this. These are facts, facts that prove he was no Satanist.

A Satanist would at least have the ambition to get a job to make his money and run the church the best way he can!

I am an ordained minister (and I started my own church in 1999), I am a certified web designer, and I am a certifed Security Officer with connections in various governments. I am also working on a NEW Satanic Bible (I have approximately a quarter of the manuscript complete and I work on it in my spare time).

You fail to understand the Church of Satan... why do you care so much for LaVey's life? He's dead. You care more about him that I do, and I'm an active member of the Church of Satan that he founded! Move on, man, LaVey has created a Church that suits many Satanists fine, he could have been the biggest fraud Humanity has ever known, it still doesn't make his creation any less useful to those who rally under it's banner.

Re: So What?

(Anonymous)
I agree w/you to a point Vexen.
However, the point in allof this is that Lavey gets praised and his Church gets praised in spit of a mountain of evidence that they are full of quite a bit of hypocrisy; the same faults that Satanists{including Laveyans and CoS'ers} attack the Christian Church for, they themselves are also guilty of it appears.

One is ledt to wonder why the CoS needs to attack all the other Satanic orgainizations and churches,etc, as false and have a "bunco sheet" against them, wherein they only provide an opinion that these groups are'nt "true" true enough{sounds like what variuos Christian denominations do, Satanism is becoming like the Christian faith and church?!}-but that's all they can really do is insult them, they provide NO CREDIBLE EVIDEENCE that many of the groups and Satanists they attack are "false" or not "true" enough; whereas, the othjer groups such as the FCoS for example{amongst others}provide credible evidence and writings and documentations and stuff that discredit or at leats call into seriuos question the integrity of the CoS and of Lavey{whilst they still give the CoS and particularly Lavey credit-where credit is due them, which is appropriate}.

If one looks throught the Satanic Bible, and through the Satanic statements,rules,etc, they will find a demand or adesire for "responsibility" and truth,etc; they will find that they atatck the Christian faith and that Satanists attack the Christian faith for it's deciet, and it's hypocrisies,and confabulations;and yet exsessively prop of the CoS and Lavey as a individual{one need to learn to seperate Lavey the confabulator/hypocrite from Lavey the philosopher or man whom made Satanism popular-allthough isn't Laveys own fans that are opposed to Satanism beeing popular?} when the CoS and Lavey are guilty of many of the same faults.

Sure Lavey did alot and the CoS did alot to make Satanism a recognized religion/irreligion; however, on the flip side of the coin, their confabulations and continued propagation of discredited myths, their unwillingness to reform and become of better integrity and less hypocrisy,their continued elitism of the CoS as 'truer' than other Satanic orgs{herd mentality}, and their conontinued allegiance to Lavey as greater than he obviuosly was{herd mentality}, as well as their subversive demand for allegiance to the CoS; this all causes the world at large and Satanic people to lose their respect for Lavey and the CoS and call into question the modern Satanic religion, they see the hypocrisy and think "how is this any different from Christianity"; many still consider themselves Satanists and still find the Satanic Bibkle book useful afterwardsnonetheless,but start new Satanic denominations hoping to have more integrity and get the Satanic religion of today more respected as one of integrity and honour, but the CoS continues to attack them for it.

This s why it matters Vexen. How can the CoS and Laveys fans hope to build of an adversrial,freethinking, pseudo-religion w/integrity when they are ins most ways acting just like the Christian Church and other absolutist religions? The CoS can still be a org of integrity "if" they will admit these things and admit Laveys confabulations{and work to have those myths removed from the Satanic Bible}and will reform themselves,in other words-take "responsibility"{isn't one Satanims main tenets/principles about "responsibility"?}

Hail Satan

HAIL REASON!

Bill B.

Thankyou Bill B. for the genuinely intelligent points you raise. Some of the issues here are some that I too have with my own COS. Some of what you say is exaggerated, i.e., I think you give too much prominence to the inter-denominational politics when in reality the majority of the CoS doesn't care what other doms do. But there are those who are as you say, undeniably. The only thing I can say is that I don't encourage it.

Yes, as you say, for the reasons you give, it DOES matter sometimes that some people are as you say. But most the time it is only petit. Everyone, sometimes, thinks in small-mind mode, but thankfully much of the energy of the CoS is directed towards big-mind, wider issues than interchurch politic.

My respected antagonist, you do well in voicing these concerns without degenerating into poor quality insults and shallow arguments. If I decide to find the time to write some of your text on to a new page on http://www.dpjs.co.uk/criticism/index.html , how would you like to be credited? As Bill B.? Any email address or website address? I'd probably have to point out that you're not Bill Bryson, the travel & popular experience author. Unless you are...

Finally, I just re-read and noted you say "their subversive demand for allegiance to the CoS", the CoS specifically state, clearly and repeatedly, that allegiance is not demanded or required in order for the CoS to consider or accept that someone is a Satanist. The CoS, and it's ruling hierarchy new and old, have always known and encouraged Satanism whether or not individuals choose to become members of the main Church.

Re: So What?

(Anonymous)
You are welcome and your points are well taken.
And thank you for your compliments.
Vexen, you are one of the few CoS members I've talked to, whom while maintaining his own personal respects for the Church and for Lavey, manages to stay balanced and not to attack those qhom do question them. I myself believe in smashing sacred cows, and think there may be some in the Satanic religion, I am glad to see that you are comfortable w/seeing someone do so.
As an individual Vexen, and as a Satanist individual, you are one of two or three well known public Satanists{w/a websitre specifically} that I have genuine respect for as a person,satanist, and site creator{one of the others is well known theistic Satanist Diane Vera; amongst others}.
Perhaps my view of the CoS is somewhat tainted by the opinions of former CoS'ers. I'm not clear on this. I've heard scary testimony alledging that the CoS leaders harrass ex-members and people whom riase quetsions about their integrity and leadership, or about Laveys.
I've not seen the proof for this{yet}, and I'd like to think that it is not true, but I'm unconviced either way regarding it.

Regarding my trying to refrain from ad hominem, I beleive this si the most respectful ay to go about things. I don't degenerate into beeing insulting very quickly.

You know, regarding Lavey, I've said some harsh things about him{and the CoS}, and am suspiciuos of{perhaps I can be proven wrong} their personal and corporate integrity, as well as Laveys{though I still enjoy his bible, particularly the book of Lucifer}; as you have said before, you pointed out that even if Laveys was a con-man and liar and hypocrite{regardless of whether he was or was not}-you still admire what he did do, and what he wrote; I feel similar, though I don't neccaserily agree w/all that he wrote, or at least too harsh and legalistic an intrpretation of it all{when one look at it all in it's full context- there is a fairly good balance of hate/love, emotion and intelect; though by no means perfect}.

Anyways, I am currently rambling, so I will let this go for now. I have somewhere to be.

As far as using my text, go ahead.
It's up to you.

Please though, refrain from my last name, just call me "IconoBill" or "Iconoclast Bill" or something along those lines.

Here is my proffesiional email address; I do not wish for you to use my personal email. So here is the professional one:
westman@universist.com

I do have some blog sites:
"The Iconoclast Project"= http://project-iconoclast.blogspot.com
"Raving Madman"= http://raving-madman.blogspot.com
"Day of Reason"= http://day-of-reason.blogspot.com
feel free to check them out and to make mention of or post them on your site if you wish{and to tell others of them}.

respectfully;

HAIL SATAN!

In Reason:
Bill B.

Satanism

(Anonymous)
Read the Satanic Bible... LaVey did not just take Satanic Doctrine from previous Satanists (like Aliester Crowley, Eliphas Levi, etc) he took their thoughts and ideas and claimed them as his own then defamed those he took ideas from!

LaVey did more harm to the Satanic Community from anywhere else! If you really respect what you think to be Satanism, then go deeper then what you learned from LaVey and learn from the earlier Satanists (George Bernard Shaw, Fredrich Nietzsche, Ragnar Redbeard, etc.)

It's time Satanists stopped praising LaVey for things that others brought to Satanism and the Satanic Community... and to those modern Satanists who are actually fighting to push the facts about Satanism instead of making futile attempts to make money off of Satanism (which is all Anton LaVey attempted... and failed to succeed in). Lets start THINKING for ourselves instead of sitting around being brainwashed by the late Anton LaVey and his excessors in the 'Church of Satan'. Wake up and smell the proverbial roses!

Ragnar Redbeard was a diabolicist, whose identity is not known. Of the two suspected authors who may have wrote under that name, neither are clearly Satanists. Nonetheless LaVey used the work, and only revealed his source later on. And possibly only because others found the source and raised questions. Which is cheeky, admittedly, but hardly defaming.

Nietzsche was not a Satanist. He would have enjoyed the mentality and creativity that surrounds the Church of Satan and it's members, but I doubt that he would have called himself a Satanist.

Levi was a raving mad paranoid Christian, a Christian demonologist and experimenter, maybe even a diabolical Christian... but all those things have in common the word "Christian", making him a Christian (even if a heretical one) or a Christian-Jew-Pagan, but no way near a Satanist.

George Bernard Shaw... who knows. I don't.

There was no Satanic community... the diabolicism and indulgent clubs (and countries, and royalty) exist in Europe as they have always done, unaffected by the American-based Church of Satan. No Satanic community existed... plenty of proto-Satanic communities have existed and continue to exist. If you count them as Satanic, they are undiminished. LaVey Satanism brought into the world a new lighthouse that slowly burns the world with a new illumination. Scarred sometimes by politics and human petit behaviour, as is every human organisation, but burning the world and dragging itself forwards nonetheless, with many wilful creatives pledging allegiance. None of this has harmed anyone, and I would not have any of it end.

LaVey may have tried, and may have failed, to make money in any way he saw fit. I don't really care about his motives, only his results. If his motives were selfish... would you be surprised? I wouldn't. The guy was a Satanist who *knew* his motives were selfish, just like everyone elses.

I have found very few members of the CoS (note that I exist in Europe, not the USA) who are brainwashed. I've also met the organizers of other Satanic groups in the UK and around Europe, and whether they're CoS or not none of them have seemed "brainwashed". They've been alert, wise, critical, powerful and indominatable. Apart from some of the younger kids, who have been critical, sceptical, intelligent even in their soemtimes misguided enthusiasm for all things alternative.

You can smell as many roses as you want; but I see no problem in tasting life and also being a member of the Church of Satan, to add one more voice to the social engineering war.

We think for ourselves. If we think for ourselves *and* we decide we want to pay a one-time fee to be a member of the CoS, do you think we're "wrong" because we think differently (in one choice) to you?

YOU OWN

(Anonymous)
Wow!! This is some good stuff. I'm trying to understand the satanic bible and this has helped

As a Spiritual Satanist, I think that the Satanic Bible is bollocks. Anton LaVey invokes the name of Satan and His demons, yet is profoundly quite atheist. I've found this with a lot of CoS members. Everyone practices Satanism in their own way, which is how it should be. I myself wasnt even born till 1984, so a lot of the stuff which was written and said about him, I hadnt even heard of till quite recently.
Everyone seems to be so concerned with the proper way of doing things, which to me seems to miss the point. I talk to people and they all seem to claim that CoS is the "only" way, and they demean people who think differently. Which is totally out of order I think, or is it just a yank thing?
Also, I see everybody who has posted a comment has done it anonymously, as if they scared of people knowing who they are.

http://www.dpjs.co.uk/true.html
There is no "true" Satanism. And yes, even members of the CoS accept that many forms of Satanism exist.

Some forms of Satanism:
http://www.dpjs.co.uk/righteous.html

These people who "all seem to cliam that CoS is the 'only' way", are clearly the wrong people for you. Find people who are not so! Find those who move forwards and do not care for denominations, only for results! They exist, I have found many such beautiful minds.

Re: re

(Anonymous)
Vexen;
you embody as an indivudual what i think every freethinking Satanist should. Though to my understanding you are a member of the CoS, you are much more fair and balanced then the Church is in their bunco, and then most others whom beleong to the CoS I've talked to, there is so much hypocrisy amongst their crowds, It is so pleasing to see that you are not one of them{the hypocrites}.

I appreciate your balance. You are the fairest member of the CoS/Lavey church crowd; many of them I'd just call "Laveyans" or "Churchists"{in regards the CoS}, not you-you are what I would say is a true Satanist.
Though you are'nt the only balanced member of the CoS{what most call "Laveyans"-but I'm reluctant to call you and others like you that}there are others; they seem to be in short supply.

Keep up your fair and balanced work in Satanism.


HAIL YOU!

In Reason:
Bill Baker

Re: re

(Anonymous)
"Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He has saved us." "The grace of God that bringeth Salvation hath appeared to all men teaching us that denying ungodliness & worldly lusts we should live soberly, righteously & godly in this present world. Looking for that blessed hope & glorious appearance of our great God & our Savior Jesus Christ." Satan was a created being. He can't save you. Only the Lord Jesus Christ can save you & I. He was a Lamb without blemish & without spot as an offering for our sin. "For all have sined & fallen short of the glory of God." Sincerely, Allison Grace Karalus

The article and various things.

To address the "Legend and Reality" article; I don't think that Zeena is one to talk about hypocrisy and abuse, being as she abandoned her pre-teen son in a foreign country, completely alone. I think that's pretty heavy abuse. And isn't advocating one thing and then suddenly changing your mind due to rather apparent personal reason, itsn't that somewhat hypocritical? Or calling your mother a "true satanist" and then changing your mind about that too, that seems just as hypocritical as anything they accuse LaVey of doing.

But saying that LaVey did beat his wives and Togar, and he did lie about everything, what the hell does that matter? That has nothing to do with what he said. And as for the plagiarism, the only reson he outright plagiarized was Redbeard, whom he referenced, just as he referenced Rand, Crowly, and the others. He was pretty straight forward about his influences, but he would outright lie as well. Personally, I think he did it because he wanted to fuck with people, to build a mystique. And I gotta say, the satanic bible is a far better read than anything Rand or Crowley ever fucking wrote, and that in my opinion is the shittiest of his books. The best of hiw work to me are the devils notebook and satan speaks, because you get a real feel for who he is. You get the feel of a very intelligent man who like fucking with people. A man who won't say dispell rumors, who in fact incourages them. I definitely don't think that makes him a fraud. He had a sense of humor, and he admitted he was a bullshitter about somethings, unlike Zeena, whom seems to have that very dangerous absolutist mentality to her.

So I guess my point is that what he said mattered, not whether or not he fuck marilyn monroe or beat his wife, and that Zeena isn't exactly a peachy clean example of rational truth herself.



It matters not whether you support LaVey, Satanism or Christianity. This article was biased, hypocritical and lacked context.

Parasites will always try and debunk LaVey and Satanism. Let them! Encourage them! Who gives?

And more often than not, they attempt to do so in a sloppy, uneducated, and redundant manner like this inane rabble scribbled by John Smulo.

I am too frequesntly dissapointed these days. The internet allows any idiot to write an 'essay' (Pah!) and publish the slop where an unsuspecting reader will, through no intention of their own, waste their all too valuable time reading it.

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